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It’ll certainly have a different number. Contact the helpdesk and ask them what you should do. You will see journey history when it’s sorted out, it’s all zero fares though.
Hi Colin,
60+ Oyster cards are not first generation, but that was what the Oyster app called them, same with zip cards. I added my 60+ Oyster to my web account as soon as I got it, perhaps try that rather than doing it through the app or TfL Go.
No, 60+ Oysters cannot have topup added to them. There is no way to tell when you might have to pay or not where different services use the same stations. For example, the 60+ Oyster is not valid on London North Western services from Watford Junction and Bushey, but it is valid on the London Overground Lioness line services. Similar issues apply with Shenfield, Cheshunt and others. There are also places like West Croydon to New Cross Gate where the 60+ is valid on London Overground Windrush line after 0900, but not on Southern until 0930.
Thanks for the update.
You didn’t exceed the maximum journey time. The TfL website says that 90 minutes is allowed for a journey in zone 1 only. Can you reply back to them and dispute their assertion? The webpage is https://tfl.gov.uk/fares/how-to-pay-and-where-to-buy-tickets-and-oyster/pay-as-you-go/keep-within-maximum-journey-times.
I can. It’s £2.20 for the evening peak trip to Brentwood and £2.00 for the off-peak return trip later on. These are the TfL-LU fares for zones 7-9 which apply for extension fares on the EL between Harold Wood and Brentwood. You can see the fares by putting Moor Park to Amersham into the fare finder.
Hope that helps.
Hi Rob,
You do get about a bit.
I hadn’t realised you were using Oyster rather than contactless. This means that the weekly capping is applied during the overnight run through the back office. In your case this would have been last night, so you should have an appropriate refund applied next time you touch in with that card. I’d be interested to know what you actually get, on the basis that neither journey to/from Brentwood was actually charged because you’d reached the daily cap.
Thanks for starting this discussion. I’ve also commented about the journeys being described by the start time and the destination station, which seems a bit perverse to me. The lack of intermediate touches makes working out why a journey might have been joined unexpectedly a bit more difficult.
The addition of journey history for ‘first generation’ cards like the 60+ is a great step forward. The cards are not first generation, of course, so I’m glad that that stupid restriction has gone. I’ll check out the live history next time I use it. I did notice that it suggests it’s possible to top up a 60+ Oyster, which it really shouldn’t allow. I didn’t actually take it through to payment, but you can get all the way through the screens without an error or warning notice.
It’s a real shame you have to switch between app and website to get the full experience.
Hi John,
Quick reply because I’m really busy at the moment.
1) Shoreham via Sevenoaks is absolutely allowed as you don’t leave the PAYG area.
2) Caps will be added shortly.
3) Peak fares queries should be directed to Southeastern who set the fares on both lines from Sevenoaks.Thanks Si,
Just to clarify, next Sunday = 2nd February in case anyone gets excited.
This is going to be a strange rollout because the fare finder will not be updated on Feb 2nd. They are still suffering after effects of the cyber security incident.
Hi Kijeta,
It’s a subtle difference, but they are still peak and off-peak fares, they’re just charged at the same price. But railcard discounts apply to off-peak fares so they appear cheaper.
Hi Adam,
That’s very strange. The route “AAA LDN ZONE 7-9” makes the ticket a day travelcard valid throughout zones 1-9. Normally the off-peak version of that is only valid after 0930. It’s possible that 0915 is a local easement for Watford High Street. I don’t think the gates at Chalfont will accept it before 0930.
Beyond that there is no need to go to Watford High Street at any time. It’s just a 1-9 travelcard.
Hi Adam,
Yes, the lack of NR trains is probably why it won’t sell you the ticket. You could try Brentwood as the origin instead, or Cheshunt, or maybe Watford High Street. Any zone 7-9 National Rail station should work, except Dartford.
Update:
Some railcard fares have been increased slightly thanks to the new policy by the Rail Delivery Group. See https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cpw8j4d1v2do for more information. Usually the single fare finder data would be updated at the same time, but the cyber security incident has delayed that.
Hi Adam,
Something appears to have got out of step. I’ve asked for clarification. The SFF (and our fare finder) is supposed to reflect actual fares charged, so it shouldn’t be wrong.
Edit: You could call the helpdesk and see if they can explain, and/or issue a credit.
As mentioned, the gold card and Railcard* discounts do not apply to peak single fares or the Anytime cap. If you travel enough in the evening peak then the discounted off-peak cap may limit your charge for the day.
Disabled railcards offer discounts all day.
Hi YOTBO,
I’m not sure whether I’ve ever had cards disappear, but what I do when a card is expired is hide it. You can do this on the website and it respects the action in the app.
Hi Kijeta,
That is an odd case, yes. I don’t know for certain, but my best guess is that the hopper will win out first, but the high zone flag for capping will also be increased to 3. This means that if you make another chargeable journey (bus/tram or train) it will deduct a charge to take you up to the zone 1-3 cap.
Do let me know if you ever try it out!
Hi John,
The main confusuon seems to be that when travelling to a dual zoned station it is treated as being in the zone relevant to where you’ve come from. In this case that is zone 2. Travelling in the afternoon peak with a railcard is one of the cases where Oyster isn’t always cheaper, especially if you don’t finish in zone 1.
The National Rail Enquiries site is definitely wrong on this. Whilst it’s good that they now seem to be defaulting to PAYG fares rather than paper ticket fares in the contactless area, they do need to get it right. I’d be interested to know what response you get from them.
As to being offered the cheaper discounted Anytime Return fare, that is simply not possible when using Oyster or contactless PAYG. If you had gone to the ticket office at Vauxhall then that is exactly what they would have sold you.
Sorry I don’t have better news, but you have been charged correctly.
Well that’s interesting. I agree that the MJTs near zone 1 suggest that more time should be allowed, but if you check my fare finder you’ll see that it is just the single zone figures for that journey.
Dare I ask how it took so long to travel one stop on the DLR?
Cheers Si,
As it’s not until next year I’ll park this here. Quite a bit to do with the phase 1b go-live later this month.
Hi Malcolm,
There are two issues with that history. First is the lack of a touch in before 1356, I presume that was at West Drayton. Second is the lack of a description for touching in at 1812, presumably at Paddington. I’d be interested to know which gateline was used for that touch in.
Whilst not wanting to disbelieve anyone, I would certainly be adding the bank card and checking for any history. 10p authorisations are only made when using a bank card for a journey, and usually only on the first touch of a day.
Hi Malcolm,
I also have a 60+ Oyster and I’ve never seen anything like a charge made to the credit card. However, whenever I use contactless I do get a 10p authorisation. This is replaced by the actual journey charge overnight, or a couple of days later if it’s an incomplete journey. I think it’s likely that your brother may have used his bank card at West Drayton instead of the 60+ card. I’ve done it myself a couple of times. I suggest he registers his bank card on his TfL account and then sees what history it shows. The helpdesk will refund the charge if one has been properly made. They don’t like doing it too many times though, as I found out the third time.
